Feb. 10, 2026

What Can History’s Most Notorious Leaders Teach You About Leading Today?

This episode is for leaders who feel boxed in by outdated rules and want practical strategies to move faster, think sharper, and lead with courage.
It’s not about copying history’s villains.
It’s about learning from what worked when the stakes were real and the margin for error was slim.

Beyond Confidence is broadcast live Tuesdays at 10AM ET on W4WN Radio - Women 4 Women Network (www.w4wn.com) part of Talk 4 Radio (www.talk4radio.com) on the Talk 4 Media Network (www.talk4media.com). Beyond Confidence TV Show is viewed on Talk 4 TV (www.talk4tv.com).

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WEBVTT

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The topics and opinions expressed on the following show are

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solely those of the hosts and their guests, and not

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those of W four WN Radio It's employees or affiliates.

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We make no recommendations or endorsement for radio show programs, services,

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be directed to those show hosts. Thank you for choosing

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W four WN Radio.

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This is Beyond Confidence with your host d W Park.

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Do you want to live a more fulfilling life? Do

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you want to live your legacy and achieve your personal, professional,

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and financial goals?

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Well?

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Coming up on Dvaparks Beyond Confidence, you will hear real

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stories of leaders, entrepreneurs, and achievers who have steps into discomfort,

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shattered their status quo, and are living the life they want.

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You will learn how.

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Relationships are the key to achieving your aspirations and financial goals.

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Moving your career business forward does not have to happen

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at the expense of your personal or family life or

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vice versa. Learn more at www dot Divpork dot com

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and you can connect with div ants Contact Dants divpark

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dot com. This is beyond Confidence and now here's your host,

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div Park.

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Good morning listeners. And when we hear about history, we

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all talk about like, hmmm, what's happening with history? We

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don't want to talk about history. Nobody wanted to remember

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the dates. But today you're going to be looking at

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history in a very very different way. And also I'm

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excited to share my book is going to be out

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this week the AI Agency, so when you get a

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chance to look it up under my name and just

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supretty excited about it.

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So welcome Steve, Hey, David, how how are you. Congratulations

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on the book, Thank you, thank you.

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So share with us as to how did you get

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into the history.

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Well, it's interesting. I spent most of my career in

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leadership positions, and I made a lot of mistakes. And

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I was on a business trip one time, probably about

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fifteen years ago, and I stopped by the bookstore in

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the Milwaukee airport and I saw a book that was

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called Leadership Secrets from Attila of the Hunt by Wes Roberts,

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and I thought that sounds interesting, so I picked it up.

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I read it on the trip, and I thought, wow,

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there's a lot of things that Attila did way back

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then that I could use to help me become a

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better leader. And I really didn't think about a book

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at the time. I just kind of started to apply

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some of the techniques. It's still sitting on my bookshelf,

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and maybe thirteen fourteen years ago I remember that book.

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I took it out and I thought, well, you know what,

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if there's one person out there that's a historical figure

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that we can learn from and apply positive lessons in

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today's management, then there's got to be a bunch of

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other ones. So then I started the research and came

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up with the cast of characters that are in the book,

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looking for not necessarily the people you would think of

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as leadership material, because they were known for being you know,

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warriors and outlaws and rebels and you know, capturing other

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tribes and kingdoms. But the thing that I thought about

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is they had to be in doing a lot of

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things right to be so successful, because every single one

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of them was extremely successful. And the more research I did,

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the more I found that, you know what, some of

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these lessons are timeless. I mean, what applied to sun

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Zoo twenty five hundred years ago, still works today. So

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I said, I wish I had a book like this

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when I was getting into leadership because it would have

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given me a you know, kind of a shortcut to

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avoid some of the pain points I went through.

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Yeah, no, definitely. So tell us about your Johnny. You mentioned,

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you know, you were in the leadership positions and all that,

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So tell us, like, you know what Philly were in,

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and tell us a little bit more about that journey.

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Sure. Absolutely. So I started out My family owned a

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small manufacturing company, So I started out in the family business.

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I learned. I'm from the Midwest, so my my folks

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and still the Midwest work ethic and going to work

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for the family business was a little challenging for any

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any I guess relative of a business owner, because you

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either have to you know, work harder than everybody else

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to prove that you're not just there because you're the

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owner's kid, or you can you know, everybody's worked for

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a business or know somebody probably were the owners children

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or relatives feel they don't have to work quite so

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hard because you know, their dad owns a company. Well,

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I had to proved myself at an early age that,

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you know what, I can stand on my own. So

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I kind of got my work ethic early on. And

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then I spent the next twenty two years as I

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moved on to various competitors of the business that in manufacturing,

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and I was always a supervisor or a manager or

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or you know, at a higher director level throughout my

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first twenty two years. And then I went to work

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for my biggest customer, which was kind of a step

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up the food chain. It was a contract manufacturer. When

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I started with them, they were, I don't know, a

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three hundred and fifty million dollar company, which you know,

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I'd been involved in small businesses, so this is kind

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of a medium sized business to me. And I was

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tasked with putting together a team that would go out

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and develop a global supply chain that would support this

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company's tremendous growth plans. When I left the company, they

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were about three billion dollars and this year they were

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about to hit four billion dollars. So we had a

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structure a go out and find companies in all the

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different kinds of you know, abrication of metal and plastics

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and printed circuit boards and electronics and assembly and cables

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and find a supply chain that would not only support

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our growth, but then we also had to manage that

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supply chain from a strategic standpoint. So me and my

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team literally got to see a thousand companies all over

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the world, so we got to see what worked really

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well and what didn't work really well. So I got

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that experience. For fifteen years, I held the position of

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Global Sourcing Comodity Manager. And then that experience taught me

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that there was a lot of people out there that

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really did a great job, but there was just as

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many people that could use some help. And my kind

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of unique experience of being you know, on the on

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the ground floor working in shops and building things to

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getting to work with these you know best, the best

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companies throughout the world that other companies could benefit from

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my knowledge. So I started this company in twenty thirteen

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and I've been going pretty strong ever since. So that

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was my that was my I guess work history. But

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I've I've always been a writer, you know, the whole time.

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Yeah, So that makes sense, and so let's kind of

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go back to your journey. So many times when we

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talk about the corporations and organizations, people have this.

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Idea of.

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People sitting either openly like you know, the working remotely,

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especially COVID, or people working in open spaces or in offices,

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and nobody focuses on the manufacturing. And I've been in

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the man on the manufacturing side, not fully, but to

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have had a lot of interactions with that and supply

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chain and all that. So let's let's kind of dive

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into that.

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Sure, absolutely, so tell me, like, you know.

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So from the manufacturing perspective, you are on the floor,

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and it's not just because what happens is that when

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you're sitting on the cube, it's you your computer team

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meetings versus this. You're experiencing like live problems throughout the day.

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And even though you may have standard operating procedures, you

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may have protocols and all of that. So tell us, like,

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you know, what were some of your learnings and what

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were some of the challenges that you faced during that time.

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You know, that's a good question and it really ties

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into kind of the theme of the book. You know,

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I I changed my leadership style just because of what

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you had just mentioned. You know, back you know, COVID

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didn't hit until I had this company, So most of

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my career was face to face meetings, a lot of travel,

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going to see customers, going to see suppliers where we

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didn't have the technology to do what we can do today.

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So one of the I guess hardest lessons that I learned,

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and one of the first lessons that I learned, is

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you really have to lead by example. You know, you

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can't be sitting in your office just barking out orders

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and expecting your people to want to follow you, because

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that doesn't work. You've got to be out there, side

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by side, on the floor with them as problems come up.

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Being out there and willing to get your hands sturdy,

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and I think that earns you a lot of respect,

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and it earns you a lot of trust. And those

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are two of the cornerstones to any great leader is

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being out there with your people, leading by example and

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not asking them to do something you haven't done yourself.

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So problems come up real time, you've got to react quickly.

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You've got to make very quick decisions. And the other

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thing that I learned is, you know, we're not perfect. Nobody,

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even the best leaders make mistakes. But the key to

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that is recognizing when you make a mistake and being

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able to course correct and change directions. So I was saying,

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you know what, guys, I steered you wrong. I told

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you what to do, and we totally mess this up.

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We got to recome up with a new solution and

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get my team's input and go out and change course.

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And I think that's one of the biggest, biggest parts

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of being a great leader is recognizing when you do

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make a mistake and being able to change it quickly.

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Absolutely. And when you talk about on the floor, tell

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us more about what kind of problems would you experience?

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Mostly quality problems? Right, so you know we mix, you know,

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we made stuff. So if there is no problems, you

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know there's not a lot of things going on out

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on the floor other than production moving and things going great.

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But no manufacturing company is that good. There's always something happening,

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whether it's a process problem or a product problem. You've

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got to get out there and get your hands dirty

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and solve it. Right. Is the equipment operating correctly? Like

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you said, You've got or constructions and documentation on how

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to actually do the job, But you're still working with people,

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and people are imperfect, so there's going to be mistakes,

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there's going to be issues that have to be handled

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is going to have to be customer interaction to determine

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whether or not we can get through this or we

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have to maybe rebuild the product or come up with

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a repair or something. So you're constantly fighting, you know,

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what the customer expects, which is perfection, versus what you

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can actually produce, which is maybe close to perfection. So

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you've always got to have that balance and be an

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advocate for the customer as well as an advocate for

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your company because you know, it's expensive to rework, it's

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expensive to scrap parts, so you've always got to be

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working on well, how do I balance that and what's

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in the best interest of all parties And those are

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the kind of things that any leader in manufacturing faces

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on an hourly basis sometimes.

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Yeah, So the thing is that it's important to incorporate

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and integrate some quality system so this way you're not

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waiting till the last minute that oh, gosh, you know

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this product hasn't turned out good. It's important to have

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those checks and balances at different time points. And whether

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it is automated, I know, like you're mentioning that, you know,

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we have got technology now, so whether it's technology or

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whether it's humans. So tell us more. I know that

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you work on the quality management systems, what are some

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of the essentials to have that in the process so

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that way you're not like experiencing the problem at the

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end of.

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The chain, right right, Well, A core part of my

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outside of my writing, my core part of my company

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is helping companies improve their business processes, which is their

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quality system. Right. It basically covers everything from quoting the

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shipping in any type of business, whether you're manufacturing or service.

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And I help them streamline their systems and put controls

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in place so that we minimize the problems. And what

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I do with every single client first time we get

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together is we kind of set expectations, right, we look

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at Okay, we got to look at where you're at now,

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where you want to be, where are your pain points,

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what's causing you the most grief? And I just go

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through once we start working together, we go through every

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single major department in the company. And I kind of

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have a little a little three three question tests that

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I asked them. I said, first off, is this process

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working the way you wanted to? Obviously they're bringing me in.

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So the processes usually aren't working as well as they'd

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like them to be. And then the third is, okay,

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is it if it is working the way you want

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it to, is there a way to streamline it and

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make it better? And then the last question that really

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is the most important is is what you're doing adding

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value to the company Because a lot of people do

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a lot of things that they think need to be done,

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but you know, whether whatever you know, if if they're

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a certified company to i say, an ISO standard, then

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they may be doing a lot of things that they

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think have to be done, but in reality it's just

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busy work, right, So it's taking away from them actually

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adding more value to the company. So we go through

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that process through all of them, and I think the

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biggest thing that that kind of a system does for

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any manufacturing or service companies it standardizes, like you said,

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standardizes work, make things consistent because people are always going

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to be, like I said, imperfect, but at least from

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a training standpoint, from a day to day operational standpoint,

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we've standardized the work process so that we should get

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fairly consistent results. And consistency is what manufacturing is all about.

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Absolutely, and you nailed it when you said that consistency

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is the key because first of all, it's got to

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be sustainable any process that you have. If you want consistent, repeatable,

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robust process and repeatable results for consistency, then the process

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is got to be producing that same every single time.

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That's where, like you know, you are talking about the

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quality checks and having those quality checks at different pain

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points is really really important. And one thing that you

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said really resonated with me is that your three questions,

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it's some how continuous improvement. Are we just doing the

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busy work or revisiting those processes and seeing, like you know,

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where could I shorten it? And even if I'm shortening

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it that it doesn't impact the quality. Where am I

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doing the busy work? So assessing those and increasing the

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value before thinking of scaling, because so many times what

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happens is there are companies they start out in a

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lot of startups have those growing pains, and then when

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there are falls then it doesn't scale. So that's really good.

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So now, of course, as we have talked about some

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of the manufacturing pains, we don't have enough time to

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go through it. So tell us like in the manufacturing arena,

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or it could be global supplier vendors like dealing or

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even for that matter, when people are there who were

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like a couple of your like you know, favorite historical

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leaders in their lifestyle and like, you know, how did

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you measure their success? How did you define their success?

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Because there are a lot of leaders out there that have

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been there and who have been viewed as fearsome and

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in some eyes they would not be successful. So what

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were your criteria as you started writing the book?

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Well, I get it. I get to ask that a

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lot that like who's your who's your favorite leader? And

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it's it's hard to pick just one or two. I

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love them all. And one of the one of the

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things I usually fall back on is there's there's two

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people in the book Sonny Barger who ran the Hills

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Angels for almost you know, five decksides and Steve Jobs.

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And because they lived in my lifetime, I got to

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see I got to see the results of their efforts

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and I lived it as they were living it. So

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the other people are historical. All you can do is

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do research and you know about him. You learn about

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how they conquered and how they did this. And Katherine

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the Great and all the things she did to maintain

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her control over Russia for you know, thirty five years.

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But the people that like Sonny and Steve Jobs. I

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was a big fan of both of those people long

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before I thought about writing the book, so I knew

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about each of them and they they were interesting. One

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of the I guess common themes that run through all

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of the characters in the book is every single one

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of them would prefer to go down the non violent

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path first. Right. They would try to negotiate agreements, settlements,

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or takeovers or negotiate a surrender without having to go

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to battle in some cases. Or they only resorted the

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violence when peace didn't work. So I thought that was

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really interesting because you don't think of people like Genghis

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Khan until Lahan and Black bearded a pirate as you know, negotiators.

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You think of them as very brutal, you know, criminals,

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but they would rather, you know, they were smart enough

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to know that that if I can if I can

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take over this this particular other competitor and not lose

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any of my men, then that's a win win, and

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they always sought to to I guess, come up with

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a win win instead of a zero sum kind of

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a negotiation, and the other thing that ran through that

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that Steve Jobs is kind of universally known as a heretic.

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You know, he he created things and did things that

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nobody expected that he always challenged the status quo. That's

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kind of the theme throughout the book as well. Every

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one of these people challenge the status quo in their

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respective time period and circumstances to kind of look like

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those three questions, right, why are we doing it this way?

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And is the best way to do things? So I

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think that there's lessons from every single one of them

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that resonate with me personally, because what I included in

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the book is there's twenty lessons, one lesson from the leader,

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and then a lesson from my personal experience with that

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particular situation where I either succeeded or failed very poorly.

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So I'm hoping the audience can can learn from my

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failures and mistakes just as much as they can learn

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from the successes of the leaders that are in the book. So,

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you know, if I had to pick a couple, I

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picked Stunning and Steve Jobs only because you know, I

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know them in real time. The other leaders are just

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you know, the re search and the records that they

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left behind of their battles, and you know their successes

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and the things that they did, right, So I guess

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I'd have to go with Sonny and Steve.

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So tell us. So one of their successes that resonated

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with two and how did you pair it with your

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own success or failure?

355
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You know. One of the things that's really interesting about

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Sonny Barger. You know you think of the Hell's Angels.

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My wife and I wrote Harley's Thirteen Years, and we

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were not part of that one percent culture. We were

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part of the ninety nine percent that just to ride

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motorcycles with a group of people. So we were a

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motorcycle enthusiasts, you know, long before or even had a

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thought about writing the book. But what Sonny did you know?

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You look at a motorcycle gang, especially an outlaw motorcycle gang.

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There's some of the toughest people in the world. Right.

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It's not like you're working with a bunchet engineers. You're

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working with people that are very violent, very brutal, and

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Sonny would motivate them and keep them under control by

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encouraging their input, getting their their perspective on decisions before

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they were made. One of the one of the core

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concepts of a motorcycle club is something called church, and

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that's kind of like a strategic meeting, right. The leadership

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team gets together at a conference table in a clubhouse,

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and that's where all the business has done for the

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for the for the motorcycle group, and all the decisions

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are made. Most groups, the president would just say here's

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what we're going to do, here's the plan, and we're

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going to go execute it, where Sonny would give everybody

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at the table of voice. And I learned a lot

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from that because when I started my career, I was

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very autocratic, right, it was my way. I thought. I

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thought I had all the answers, Sonny. Sonny is that

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great leaders know they don't have all the answers. They

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want to surround themselves with, you know, the biggest and

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the brightest people that they can find. And I really

385
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really changed my leadership style when an employee came up

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to me after I had given out the day's orders

387
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for what had to get done, and she said, you

388
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know what, you need to listen to us a little

389
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bit more. And that was really, you know, a smack

390
00:22:24.240 --> 00:22:26.519
in the head, thinking that you know what, I don't

391
00:22:26.559 --> 00:22:28.599
have all the answers. The people that are actually doing

392
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the job know that job way better than I ever will.

393
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So that taught me to involve them in decisions, to

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take their input, to get a diversity of perspectives. And

395
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you know it's kind of overused, but really two heads

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